14 replies to this topic

[leader2]

Hi. I apologize if this is in the wrong forum, but I wasn't sure where to put it. I heard about the new Kindle fire and heard that it is wireless and can connect to the internet, but has no 3g support. I tried to read about 3g on wikipedia, but it was a bit too technical for me to understand I'm sorry to say. Can someone tell me if the lack of 3g means that a kindle fire can't be used outside of a house while browsing the internet? I'm guessing it could surf in another room of your house away from your computer, but can you take it miles away from your home and still search the internet and read emails on it is my question. I know Ipads have 3g and my First Lady was able to browse away from her home with no problem on her Ipad 2. But I don't know about the Kindle Fire's ability to do this. Also does anyone here think the Kindle Fire is worth getting? I know the reviews on Amazon.com are mixed and I'd like to hear what you guys think. And does anyone here have and can recommend a tablet aside from the Ipad? I don't know if any of the other tablets have flash, but I would prefer one with flash capabilities and a price tag closer to the kindle fire if you know of one. I would appreciate any help you guys can give on this question and thanks for helping with my understanding. I'm not very technical so it's good to know I can come here and get help from great people like you guys. Thanks again! leader2

Edited by leader2, 11 December 2011 - 11:02 PM.

[terry1966]

can't recommend any ipad type device other than to do what your doing and check reviews with google, but has far as the 3g question goes, any device that can connect using 3g means it can connect more or less anywhere in the world that you can get a signal on your mobile phone because 3g is a telephone communication standard so uses the telephone network system/masts where has wi-fi only connects to a local wireless network so you need to be somewhere that you can receive a signal from a public or private local network(router) inside or outside a building. who's your first lady? eldest daughter? only asking because i've never heard that phrase before.

[leader2]

Terry I'm still not sure if I know how what you are saying applies to my question. Would the building need wifi or 3g capabilities in order for a person to use an ipad or kindle fire while inside? A First Lady is the wife of a president, governor or in my case Pastor. (It's ok you don't have to be embarrassed and I don't mind you asking . Terry do they have First Ladies in the UK where you are?) She has an Ipad and while at church after service was able to get to her email with no problem, but I don't know of the church having wi fi or 3g capabilities. She just browsed to her email and it worked. For instance if a person has a kindle fire and it works at their home would it work anywhere else outside of their home and away from their computer? And would that same scenario apply to an ipad? Sorry for my lack of understanding. I'm just trying to get a better feel for what you are saying.

Edited by leader2, 15 December 2011 - 10:46 PM.

[terry1966]

yes all tablets can be used anywhere it just depends on the type of wireless signal in the area if it could connect to the internet tho.

so if it had 3g it would work anywhere there's a 3g signal(nearly everywhere your mobile phone works) without you having to do anything(don't forget 3g isn't free and will cost you extra money to use).

with wi-fi(usually free) you'd need to get the pad to search for an unencrypted wireless lan(local area network) signal to connect to.
it's exactly the same thing you do when your at home and connect a pc to your router, first you have to get the pc to search for the wireless signal and then tell the pc to connect to it, but if you have a secured wireless lan running(which everyone should do) you also need to enter the passphrase before it will connect.

now when your out and about with your tablet you wouldn't know the passphrase on any secured lan's so would only be able to connect to open public lans and to be honest i have no idea what sort of coverage you have there but over here in my town i could probably get a wi-fi connection near enough anywhere i was likely to use it.

so really with wi-fi the connection would depend on where you live and what sort of open wi-fi access is available there for you to connect to the internet, while with 3g your more or less going to get an internet connection anywhere.

here's a link that gives a quick pro/con comparison of both the wi-fi only ipad and 3g ipad. :- http://www.pcworld.c...ht_for_you.html

personally if a tablet had good reviews and i liked it but it didn't have 3g i'd still buy it, knowing i could connect it to a smart phone by wi/fi and use it's 3g connection to connect to the internet if i really needed to. :- http://www.carphonew...rnet-connection

no we don't use the term first lady over here for anyone and the only time i knew the term first lady was used is when referring to your presidents wife, i'd never heard anyone else using the term for any other lady and why i was a bit confused so asked.

Edited by terry1966, 16 December 2011 - 01:02 PM.

[leader2]

Hi Terry and sorry for my late reply. The kindle fire is wireless and doesn't need a computer so am I to assume that I could take it anywhere on earth and it would work or would it go out without a good wireless signal? Wireless automatically means wifi right? I'm not sure if it does which is why I'm asking. And Terry what do they call Pastor's wives over in England? Over here they call them First ladies. I'm just curious to know how it is in your country. Thanks

[Doug]

CNET has a fairly comprehensive review that will help guide you through your decision making quandry.
http://news.cnet.com...should-you-buy/

There are several selections and a key difference between some units is Wi-Fi vs. 3G access.

Wi-Fi is your wireless internet account access via your wireless router.
When you are at home or close (within several meters) of your wireless router, you can download the reading material (books, magazines, newspapers) or media material such as movies if compatible to your tablet. Then once you have downloaded the material, you can disable your Wi-Fi connection and enjoy your reading.
You can read or view anything you've already downloaded without being connected to the internet, same as viewing any media that you may have downloaded to your computer.

The attractive feature of tablets, is that they are small and light weight.
You really can "take them anywhere in the world" and enjoy your reading and viewing of pre-downloaded material.
Until the batteries run down, or until you've read/viewed all the material and again need to download.
(But you can save the equivalent of a few books in the tablet memory in most cases, and that should last you for a while.)

But in order to download fresh material, you will need an internet connection.

Kindle Fire (the new version) does not have 3G (cell-phone like) connectivity, and you would have to be close to your own or someone else's Wi-Fi router, or near a Wireless "hot-spot". Or... many Cell Phones have the functionality to make connection to the internet and transfer that connectivity to devices like tablets that require Wi-Fi.

I do hope that by reading the CNET review, you will get most of your questions answered.

If not, post back.

Best Regards

[Doug]

As to your "First Lady" question. I've studied at many churches and belonged to a few, here in the US. If the Pastor's name was Mr. Smith or Pastor Smith, or Reverend Smith, and he was married... My experience is that his wife would be known as Mrs. Smith. I have never encountered a situation where the Pastor's wife was referred to as the "First Lady".

[Doug]

Hi. I apologize if this is in the wrong forum, but I wasn't sure where to put it.

I heard about the new Kindle fire and heard that it is wireless and can connect to the internet, but has no 3g support.

I tried to read about 3g on wikipedia, but it was a bit too technical for me to understand I'm sorry to say.

Can someone tell me if the lack of 3g means that a kindle fire can't be used outside of a house while browsing the internet?

I'm guessing it could surf in another room of your house away from your computer, but can you take it miles away from your home and still search the internet and read emails on it is my question.

I know Ipads have 3g and my First Lady was able to browse away from her home with no problem on her Ipad 2.

But I don't know about the Kindle Fire's ability to do this.

Also does anyone here think the Kindle Fire is worth getting? I know the reviews on Amazon.com are mixed and I'd like to hear what you guys think. And does anyone here have and can recommend a tablet aside from the Ipad? I don't know if any of the other tablets have flash, but I would prefer one with flash capabilities and a price tag closer to the kindle fire if you know of one.

I would appreciate any help you guys can give on this question and thanks for helping with my understanding. I'm not very technical so it's good to know I can come here and get help from great people like you guys.

Thanks again!

leader2

Leader2,

I re-read your opening post in this topic to re-think what question you were actually asking.

After review, it appears to me that your interest in this type of device may be broader than the specific of "reading downloaded text, as in novels and books".
I say that because you refer to "browsing the internet" and that might also encompass reading and hoping to reply to email and/or IM while mobile.

Kindle, and its same category of readers group, "can" access the internet, and can download to display various media, and to a limited extent, can "browse".
But the primary objective of Kindle and similar, is to capture large volumes of "text" information and thereafter display it for your leisurely or current news reading.

In my opinion, the "tablet" market of devices with be advancing "very" rapidly.
Kindle is a "very" basic and limited subtype in a larger category, and is also very low power and limited in primary purpose to accommodate the user's interest in "reading", and not much else.

Again, in my opinion, many of the folks who are buying Kindle and other entry level devices in this rapidly expanding device type, are almost certainly heading for disappointment in the "very" near future, unless their only goal for to obtain a device for "reading".

Have a look at this article from PCWorld to get another glimpse of what may be coming soon.
http://www.pcworld.c...l_mcx_h_cbintro

And if you are ready to make a purchase, be sure you have settled your goal and know that at this time you will be mostly be purchasing a portable reading machine, and not much else.

Best Regards

[leader2]

Thanks for your reply Doug. I guess they just refer to the Pastor's Wives as First Ladies in the Church of God in Christ (COGIC) This has been the case at every COGIC church I have ever seen and so I thought it was the case at other churches. I have never attended a church where the Pastor's wife was just referred as Mrs. Every church I ever attended had given the pastor's wife a title. Even at Victory Christian center where Pastor Billy Joe Daughtery's wife was referred to as Pastor Sharon Daughtery. That was the only church I was a member of where the wife wasn't a first lady, but she still had a real title. I've even heard the term Missionary used for first ladies who were Missionaries in COGIC churches. So I guess it depends on the church you go to. Thanks for the information about the tablets. I am interested in a tablet computer, but definitely couldn't afford $500 for an IPad and didn't want to be bothered with the lack of flash support that it has. (That makes no sense to me Doug since I've heard it limits the websites you can go to. For instance, my first lady can't play the Facebook game Gardens of Time on her Ipad2 because of this. Doug if you know more about the Ipad lacking flash capability then please let me know. I like the Ipad2, but the lack of flash and ability to browse or utilize flash based websites bothers me. I want to use all of the web and not part of it you know. Does apple plan to do anything about this based on what you know Doug?) I saw the Kindle Fire and knew that it was an e reader but since it was advertised as more than an ereader thought it would work for browsing the web and checking emails since it said it could do that on the site. I would like to browse the internet and check emails in my room away from my desktop which is in the downstairs living room and do the same at locations away from my home. Miles away and perhaps even out of state if I vistited my grandmother. I heard the Kindle Fire was wireless and didn't need a computer, which led me to believe that the internet would work fine anywhere in the world. Doug are you saying that the Kindle Fire wouldn't work for a user like me? I mean they did say it was more than just an ereader like the regular Kindle. It may not be as full featured an Ipad 2 and I didn't expect it would be for the price, but I thought it would work as advertised and allow users like myself to browse the internet and send emails which I did on the Ipad 2. The price at 199 is better for me and I'm not expecting it to compete with my desktop just browse and send some emails in my room and away from home. I never had any interest in the ereader feature at all to be honest. Just the ability to browse and check emails. It even said it could stream movies and tv shows, which I am not interested in either but I figured if it is powerful enough to do that then it wouldn't have trouble just browsing the internet. Doug if the Kindle fire isn't good enough to use to browse the internet and check emails (why do think they advertised it being able to do that and it couldn't? That's false advertising) could you recommend a tablet that costs the same? Thanks again ')

[Doug]

Leader2,

I'm not saying that the Kindle will not work as advertised.
I'm saying that you may be disappointed with its performance.

And further, I think that Kindle buyer/users are going to be even more disappointed over time that they plunked down $199.00, which could have gone a long way toward a laptop or one of the next generation of tablets that will be rolling out with substantial power and storage innovation on at least an annual basis and probably more like 6 month cycle of improvements for devices available for purchase in the next 6 months.

The Kindle Fire will do what it says it will do... which is primarily assist you with reading and viewing content including subscription to media from Amazon. Secondarily it can also be used for web browsing and email reading/replying.

But unless I was going to primarily use it for entertainment reading books, I probably wouldn't be satisfied with its small form-factor and slower responsiveness.

For instance, if I were to go out on the porch or another room for reading my emails and browsing the web, I anticipate that I'm most likely be inclined to come back to this Desktop.

It's a seven inch screen with 8gb of storable memory.
It is primarily designed for purpose of book reading and media viewing.

It even said it could stream movies and tv shows, which I am not interested in either but I figured if it is powerful enough to do that then it wouldn't have trouble just browsing the internet.

That's where my skepticism jumps in.
I'd be willing to wait 6 months to see what innovations the market has to offer.

But the price is good at $199.00.
There are no "tablets" that can be recommended at that price.

[paws]

Hi leader2,
Terry and Doug have explained the technical side in their usual comprehensive and accurate way.

However I get the feeling that you are hoping to be able to email and browse the Web more or less anywhere even away from your home ...a bit like a smartphone or a tablet.....

It doesn't work that way.....
I am going to cut a few "corners" in order to make the message clear (so purists please forgive me)
Here's how it works:

1 its basically a "reader" for use in downloading books and once downloaded, repeat once downloaded, you can read them anywhere.
2 it does has additional functionality and can be used for some email on Gmail, Hotmail etc. and browsing the Web BUT and its a big BUT....
3 You have to have it within approximately 100 feet or so of a wireless access point that you are authorised to use..... it won't be able to download emails and browse the web...if it's further away than that...

so now we have to consider the typical wireless access points that you are likely to come across and where you have legitimate access:

4 Your home will probably have a router that includes a wireless access point ( WAP) and you will be able to use the signal from that WAP on your Kindle fire for email and browsing up to around 100 feet or so, so the garden or yard, or patio on a lot of homes might be OK..... (the wireless signal is not generally very powerful and is attenuated by solid objects like doors walls etc...... ) that why the range of the signal is often better outdoors in clear air free from obstructions.

5 If you travel to a relative or friend's home and they authorise you to use their wireless access point (WAP) and tell you the password or key...then you will be able to use the email app and browse within the same 100 feet radius of their WAP to download your stuff.

6 There are WAP's around the country that hotels and shops let you use for free...in my location Starbucks the coffee house and Macdonalds the fast food outlets, come to mind but there are many others....However you still have to be in range of them.....often the range is reduced so you actually have to be indoors sitting in their premises to get a connection.

7 Some small campsites provide a WAP for their guests but here in the UK charge quite a bit for the access to their WAP's. they usually fit "range enhancers" of one sort or another and these allow connection to their WAP from a few hundred yards, but rarely any more. They don't give you the password/access code until you have paid for the service....
There are many more examples but I hope you get my drift.

Now let's consider where you can't connect your Kindle wirelessly...:

8 Anywhere that's "out of range" of a WAP (lets say more than 100 feet or so for a home type router/WAP and say 200 yards for a small campsite's WAP

[indent=1]9 So it's no good in the car on the open road, or in the next village or town unless you are right next to a WAP where you have the password/access code[/indent.]

10 in a lot of jurisdictions its illegal to "muscle in" on some other guy's WAP (even if he has been careless and not encrypted his WAP,so no password or access code is needed.) In the UK where I'm located folks have been jailed for "stealing" wi fi access in this way..... I don't know what the rules are in your location......... but its best to check! I'd hate to see you in the "slammer"...

11 The adverts are quite right.... you can use some forms of email and browse the web using the Kindle Fire BUT you have to be within "range" and that range as we have seen is not very great.

12 Smartphones and some tablets and some computers, IPads etc use an extra system that in addition to the above uses similar technology to mobile phones/cellphones/handys....this means that they can be used practically anywhere that a cellular phone can get a signal and that can be 40 or 50 miles away from the cellular antenna. When you are getting that sort of distance from a cellular transmitting/reciving antenna then the next antenna is likely to beonly just over the hill, so overall, coverage can be very good.

13 Some Kindles can be bought with a 3g wireless facility that allows downloading of books etc and visiting the Amazon store, and a few other things if you are crafty using the cellular phone networks...... they usually are priced at a 50% markup or so compared with a non 3g Kindle.
However they are not the same as a tablet or Ipad and it's understandable as you can't expect a relatively inexpensive piece of kit to do the same sort of work as machines costing 3 times as much.
I hope this helps.

To sum up:
the Kindle Fire is not what you want for browsing /emailing away from home or on the road when more than a short distance from a WAP that you have legitimate access to.
Regards
paws

[leader2]

12 Smartphones and some tablets and some computers, IPads etc use an extra system that in addition to the above uses similar technology to mobile phones/cellphones/handys....this means that they can be used practically anywhere that a cellular phone can get a signal and that can be 40 or 50 miles away from the cellular antenna. When you are getting that sort of distance from a cellular transmitting/reciving antenna then the next antenna is likely to beonly just over the hill, so overall, coverage can be very good.

To sum up:
the Kindle Fire is not what you want for browsing /emailing away from home or on the road when more than a short distance from a WAP that you have legitimate access to.
Regards
paws

Thanks Doug for your reply and thank you so much paws for your answer. You broke it down very well for this technical novice (I really struggle with my understanding of technical and computer related issues. I've never really caught on to the technical end with all the jargon. I just know enough to do what I need to do on the computer for my daily tasks. I admire people like you guys who are so knowledgeable. I try to take everything in but a lot of times I get lost. It helps when people like you help people like me. Thanks so much for your time and patience. I don't know where I would be without them when it comes to technical knowledge. Your understanding helps me to learn. Thanks again for the great breakdown. That really helped clear up my understanding. )

Paws you and Doug agree that Kindle Fires are limited in terms of my needs. Would either one of you think that an android tablet could work for my needs?

To:

A. Browse the internet

B. send and check emails

C. read pdf files

D. Do all of this away from my downstairs computer and away from home. (Miles away from home and at even across state lines).

Paws it sounds to me like you are saying an ipad2 could do all of this if I am correct from your response in no. 12, but I am not quite sure. I believe androids can do everything that Ipads can except they have flash which is definitely what I want. If the Kindle isn't suited for my needs I guess I could wait longer until I could afford a more expensive android full featured tab. Paws could an android fulfill my needs properly? Maybe a Samsung Galaxy Tab? Please do let me know. I want to be absolutely clear on this before I invest anything in it.

Thanks

[paws]

Hi Leader2 and very Happy Christmas to you and yours.

Yes the Ipad with 3g might fit the bill for you, but over here they cost nearly GBP£500 that's around USD$750 or so equivalant...but things may be a deal cheaper in your neck of the woods.... If you definitely want Flash then maybe an Android OS is a better choice...but do make sure that you understand what Flash does and why you might prefer a machine that runs it OK................... before you make your final decision.... ( there's a deal of research for you to do here,so you are completely clear on the features, advantages and benefits, as its not as simple a concept as it might appear to be on first sight)

Maybe a Samsung Galaxy Tab?

If you can get one with 3g then yes...otherwise you are limited to the short range from a WAP that we spoke of earlier....
They are not, as far as I'm aware, fitted with 3g over here in the UK...maybe its different in your neck of the woods.....?

To sum up you need a 3g capability...just plain and simple......... wifi on its own will not do the job you want to do......
Some small notebook computers come with 3g built in as do most smartphones...... other wise you can get a broadband dongle for 3g reception either on a PAYG (pay as you go) or Contract (so much per month) that will give you 3g reception on your laptop, or netbook for example. You will need to check with your local broadband 3g carriers to see what's available and to make sure that it's suitable for your requirements.
Regards
paws

Edited by paws, 25 December 2011 - 02:36 AM.

[Lee]

Any device that uses 3G (there is now 4G here in Australia which is a big improvement over 3G) can do all the things you want but be aware, your using "mobile phone" services (3G / 4G) for anything internet related. You really need to be on an expense account (or wealthy) not a private account, as the bills can very easily blow you out of the water!

Kindle's and various other flavors of it, are basically e-book readers that are locked-in to certain e-book supply sources for each particular brand, as the manufacturers all do deals with places like Amazon etc. ( restrictive). Prices of e-readers are on the way down big-time and are available for as little as $100 here in Oz, depending on brand, in-built functionality or add-ons available for these readers.

The "do it all" mobile for me if I needed one would be an iPhone. Apple are close to releasing the iPhone 5 which would be worth waiting for.

The iPhone 5 - Coming June 2012
The all new iPhone 5 is already buzzing with speculation. Will the iPhone 5 be a complete redesign? Yes! The current Apple iPhone release wasn't much to rave about, although people do really like Siri, the personal assistant. However, the iPhone 5 is going to have some amazing new hardware and features like 3D video and pictures, newly designed keyboards and 4G speeds to name a few!

The new iPhone 5 is going to be loaded with awesome new features like video chat on 3g and 4g (no longer restricted to WiFi only), face recognition and extreme downloading with 4G. Also there is a new chat service between Apple devices! Similar to the blackberry messenger service. It has also been integrated into the SMS/MMS application used originally on the iPhone models.

http://clandestine.h...-4G-Coming-2010

That is the way I would go as anything Google Android based, although catching up and even ahead in smartphone sales in some countries, is Linux based and apart from all the hype, the reality will be endless app. pain, as all Linux based software is "open source" (millions of different software writers = trouble). I'd stick with Apple every time.

Cheers,
Lee

[leader2]

I'm back now guys. Thanks for your recommendations. I will definitely use them when purchasing a tablet in the future, but since Lee said what he said will use extreme caution with the 3g side of things. You guys have been really helpful. Thanks again!