Two PCs, same problems.

Never mind then………..sorry to waste time………it's a format job on both…..they didn't nickname me the Executioner for nothing Thanks JackAll.

sorry to waste time

Not mine.

[Not mine]…….Well, yeah, a bit, so sorry (and Chewy) And Ken, not really, because if it had been a 'nasty', it would have been relatively simple to deal with.

With what is happening with these two (which may or may not be connected) it seems more major than malware……..I'm wondering if it could be a partial RAM failure (due to one of the symptoms……I'm getting an intermittent annoying refresh in some programs now) or maybe a graphics card deterioration…….if it's not corrupted registrys due to a corrupt auto update/download.

The only way I guess I'm going to find out is to uninstall / reload without auto update / check out the guts (making sure all the RAM sticks are properly seated etc…..maybe even whip the heat sink off and re-do the thermal grease).

Thanks again. JA.

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You definitely need to avoid reformatting as that is ALWAYS a last ditch effort. When you format your boot drive, you lose:

• All hardware drivers, including:
  • Drivers specific to XP SP2 (or Vista),
  • Drivers specific to your motherboard, such as those needed for on-board graphics, sound, networking, USB I/O, SATA/SCSI controllers, etc.
• Data files - including,
  • Documents, spreadsheets, databases, etc.,
  • Photos, music/audio and video,
  • Email (if using Outlook Express, Outlook or some other "client-based" (installed on local computer) email program), as well as any saved contacts, appointments, and notes,
  • Favorites/Bookmarks,
• Downloaded programs, and all the updates to them, including all required security applications,
• Custom configurations, for Windows and all other programs,

…and worst of all,

• All Service Packs, Security Patches and Critical Updates installed since the installation disk release date are lost, setting the security defenses months, or even years behind!

Once all repair options have been exhausted and the decision is to go ahead and reformat/reinstall, you must:

• Ensure you have backed up all critical data and files,
• Have all original installation disks and the CD/license keys on hand for Windows, as well as any other applications you have installed from CD, DVD, or download,
• Have copies of all hardware drivers on CD, either original maker's driver disks, or better yet, by downloading (the latest version) from maker's download pages and burn them to CD, including drivers for,
  • The motherboard devices (including those for integrated devices),
  • Graphics card (if not integrated),
  • Sound card (if not integrated) (technically, sound is not needed, or at least, can wait),
• SP2 (if not on install disk) - for the cost of shipping and handling (about $3.50 in the US), you can order Windows XP SP2 on CD or download the free Windows XP SP2 Network Installation Package (be sure to install SP2 immediately after XP, before anything else),
  (Note: You may want to consider creating a "Slipstream Disk", see The ElderGeek - Slipstreamed Windows and/or Paul Thurrott's - Slipstreaming Windows disk.)
  
• Current copy of your anti-virus program (I would also recommend replacing Windows Firewall with a full two-way firewall at this time).

At the very least, you should attempt to repair your installation of XP before attempting to format and reinstall. See Michael Stevens XP Repair Install for complete instructions and necessary precautions.
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SP2 (if not on install disk) - for the cost of shipping and handling (about $3.50 in the US), you can order Windows XP SP2 on CD or download the free Windows XP SP2 Network Installation Package (be sure to install SP2 immediately after XP, before anything else),
(Note: You may want to consider creating a "Slipstream Disk", see The ElderGeek - Slipstreamed Windows and/or Paul Thurrott's - Slipstreaming Windows disk.)

I have tested a sp3 slipstreamed disk on 2 computers so far as clean installs, it was nice to go to windows update, validate and say no I don't want IE7

The only other advise I could add to Bill's would be, be little slower and methodical about loading your programs, try to monitor the changes they are making , several I saw here and at BC were suspect. Not sure about activex from your internet provider?

My rule of thumb is try to keep programs from loading at boot and their associated services unless I absolutely have to have them do so.

The list of possible conflicts from too many running would be a long one and it's almost impossible to figure out which 2 don't get along.

In dvd burning we see this all the time, one computer might do well with a certain combination, another might crash frequently.

It only takes one corrupt file or driver.

Slipstreaming is certainly convenient, but…

it was nice to go to windows update, validate and say no I don't want IE7

That's too bad you feel that way - it's a mistake! And, sadly, that choice makes you part of the security problem in the world today, and frankly, a threat to the rest of us. I would ask you never connect those machines to a network that has Internet access. Not good. Seriously.

Even if you don't use Internet Explorer, you should still upgrade to IE7as Windows uses IE for several internal tasks. By not upgrading to the latest security levels, known venerabilities are left exposed, and targeted. The computer, and the users that use it, are put at greater risk of compromise, and/or incorporation into a botnet and used as a weapon against the rest of us!

Well if that's true, then why did microsoft leave IE7 and MP11 out of SP3?

Well if that's true, then why did microsoft leave IE7 and MP11 out of SP3?

Because browsing the Internet, listening to tunes and watching video clips are not operating system functions.

MS is damned if they do and damned if they don't. They get slammed for omitting add-ons, and they are sued to pieces for behaving like a monopoly when they lump extra add-ons in.

Bottom line: Microsoft must treat those items as separates programs.

2,3. IE and WMP versions have not been updated by XP SP3. This was a decision made keeping in mind that certain customers are still not willing to move to the new versions and it would not be advisable to force them to uddate by means of SP3.

Rest of topic in the link.

IE7 doesn't seem to working very well if you survey the HJT forums I install firefox w/ noscript and update java and immunize with spybot resident av protection seems to be a flop also

IE7 doesn't seem to working very well if you survey the HJT forums

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resident av protection seems to be a flop also

Those instances are most likely to be error40 (The person sitting 40cm from the screen)
and not their browser or AV. So I wouldn't blame IE7 or AV programs if they are descent ones.
The lack of surfing-discipline and the lack of updating properly are the primary causes along with downloading / installing (p2p) without discrimination, that people get troubles with malware.

Anyways, this isn't helping Jackall, and should be discussed in a separate topic. I linked to the topic regarding IE7 / WMP11 in SP3 to try put a stop to it. Lets not forget the OP please.

Regards Abydos

Anyways, this isn't helping Jackall, and should be discussed in a separate topic. I linked to the topic regarding IE7 / WMP11 in SP3 to try put a stop to it. Lets not forget the OP please.

Under just about every other circumstance I would agree 100% but Jackall already said he did not want to pursue troubleshooting his two PCs so I feel this thread - until he objects - should keep going as is as it may be a learning experience for all of us. Again, I accept taking a thread off topic is wrong, but this is just after hour talk now - and not about SP3 either.

IE7 doesn't seem to working very well if you survey the HJT forums

Ahh! Okay, true colors come out - this, to you, have become about FF. It was about upgrading from IE6 to IE7, but okay. No problem.

First, if you surveyed the world, you would see HJT posters are but a tiny tiny fraction of the total number (100s of millions!) of users. Don't be fooled by the hype spewed forth by MS bashers and FF zealots! Firefox is a great browser, no doubt, but using FF does not automatically make you safe, or even safer, nor does using IE automatically make you easy pickings for bad guys. If that were the case, the nearly 1 Billion Windows machines in the world today would be totally infested, if not overwhelmed and dead already.

I ask every time I have these encounters who here stopped getting compromised simply by switching to FF?

Regardless, the browser, you still have to practice safe computing, that is, you must keep your systems patched, updated, scanned and blocked. You have to run behind a firewall, a router with at least NAT is desired, and you still must have a good AV and anti-spyware, and you have to keep them all updated. And finally, you can't go to sites where badguys are known to wallow in - porn, P2P where illegal file sharing is tolerated, chat rooms, etc.

resident av protection seems to be a flop also

Resident AV protection? Huh?

FWIW, I have two near base-line test machines here that are running XPP Home SP2, IE7, AVG Free, Windows Defender, and Windows Firewall. They automatically download, and yell at me to install critical updates, which I install after 48 hours of listening and hearing of no problems. They are both behind a typical Linksys 10/100 router with NAT. They are running and connected to the Internet 24/7, and are used for research, on-line banking, email, and Internet shopping (Newegg, LandsEnd, iTunes, eBay, etc.) on a daily bases. (I have a 3rd system, same set up, but with IE8 Beta). Basically, they are not used for porn, or illegal file sharing, other than that, all else goes.

Windows Defender and AVG check for updates and scan nightly - and both, of course, are real-time. Other than that, no download or attachment is opened without scanning first, regardless the source. And for the record, outside of few typical tracking cookies, manual spyware scans are consistently clean.

My point - when it comes to browsers and security, it's 99% human, 1% browser that makes the difference. So while yes, I'll concede that if I only could rely on my browser to stay safe, then give me FF. Otherwise, both FF and IE users must set up their defenses the same, and take the same precautions when surfing, downloading, and opening attachments. They still must practice safe computing.

My point - when it comes to browsers and security, it's 99% human, 1% browser that makes the difference. So while yes, I'll concede that if I only could rely on my browser to stay safe, then give me FF. Otherwise, both FF and IE users must set up their defenses the same, and take the same precautions when surfing, downloading, and opening attachments. They still must practice safe computing

I agree with this, I still don't see IE6 as a significant security risk when coupled with safe surfing, regarding antivirus I tested a file that a client's son installed off limewire, the install sent the computer and McAfee into a total meltdown, before that I worked on a computer that was infected from a usb drive, tea timer locked that one up to where I had to run windows as a repair disk twice. The same infection on a computer without resident protection cleaned up rather easily with fairly common tools.

IE 7 and MediaPlayer 11 were not developed with windows xp in mind and I feel it's safer to leave them off.

I agree with this, I still don't see IE6 as a significant security risk when coupled with safe surfing, regarding antivirus I tested a file that a client's son installed off limewire, the install sent the computer and McAfee into a total meltdown, before that I worked on a computer that was infected from a usb drive, tea timer locked that one up to where I had to run windows as a repair disk twice. The same infection on a computer without resident protection cleaned up rather easily with fairly common tools.

Well, okay - but so? That has nothing to do with IE6, IE7, or SP3. If a user downloads and installs an infected file, that's hardly the browser's fault.

IE 7 and MediaPlayer 11 were not developed with windows xp in mind and I feel it's safer to leave them off.

Well, sorry, but you are wrong - at least in terms of IE7 - there is absolutely no way you are safer staying with IE6. So don't be part of the problem. It's not like IE7 came out yesterday.