48 replies to this topic

[TonyG123]

hey ok so i dont know if this is in the right section so ill post it here. the problem i have is when i play games (Warcraft 3 The Frozen Throne) to be precise it seems that whenever i play big custom made maps, my computer goes all choppy and jerky and i cant control properly and its very annoying. i bought 2 GB of ram the other day and it seems to have gotten a little better but it still does it. could it be because my graphics card is not good or maybe i dont have to correct drivers for it or something ? i dont know why it does this or how to stop it, does anyone know what i could possibly do to fix this? if it would help to show you my system spec then just say and ill post it. cheers

[Doug]

if it would help to show you my system spec then just say and ill post it.

Let's go one better. Then we won't have to be playing a guessing game.

Please Run the PCPitstop Full Tests, here:
http://www.pcpitstop...top/default.asp
Register and create a password
Accept the ActiveX component to allow your machine to run the Full Tests
Registering and accepting the ActiveX are both SAFE and FREE.
Full Tests is the first item in the left hand column of that page.

The Full Tests take less than 5 minutes for most machines.
Once you have your Results, please post the TechExpress Link back here into this thread for review.
TechExpress is the last item on the list in the yellow box in upper right area of any Results page.
Post the entire URL link information back here into this Forum thread.

Caution: During the testing of Video Adapter, a variety of patterns, shapes, colors and text are “flashed” onto the users monitor screen. In the many thousands of daily uses of the PCPitstop Full Tests over several years, two individuals who suffer epilepsy experienced discomfort and temporary dizziness when viewing the flashing patterns.
If you know that you are susceptible to photo driven seizure, look away from your screen during the Video Adapter testing sequence.

[TonyG123]

ok i think i did everything that you say and this is the link:

http://www.pcpitstop...RDTTW9B3DGS7XLG

thanks.

[Doug]

TonyG123

You have a good mid-range machine that should be able to handle online multi-player games up to and a bit beyond WarCraft 3, but would not do well with some of the more demanding first-person-shooter games, especially if attempting to play at higher levels of resolution and feature.

You should complete the PCPitstop Tune-Up Tips.
Note: You should use the "manual methods" for completing these tips and don't get distracted with buying the various automated utilities that PCPitstop offers to do the jobs for you. (Those utilities are all of good quality, and recommendable, but none of the Tune-Up Tip jobs are beyond the average computer savvy level user to do manually) (Also, please ignore the Driver Update recommendation.... Drivers don't need to be updated unless they are not performing. The PCPitstop alert is just telling you that "newer" Drivers are available, not that the newer Driver will improve function for your machine in its present configuration of operating system, hardware, and application software)
___________-

The recommendation to Defrag may be a key issue, as gaming files can become and stay quite fragmented.
Reboot into SAFE Mode to perform Disk CleanUp, (CHECKDISK optionally if you want), and then Defrag.
______________

The single "troublesome" item that jumps out at me in your machine's profile is your TCP Window Size - 256960
The recommended "best" setting would be 64240.
_______________

I'm no specialist when it comes to TCP, but here's a "laymen's explanation".

A "TCP Window Size" dictates the amount of outstanding (unacknowledged by the recipient) data a sender can send on a particular TCP connection before it gets an acknowledgment back from the receiver that it has gotten some of the information.

The "Standard" maximum amount of data that can be sent, before receipt is acknowledged, is 64KB.
This is to assure that the receiver, is in fact getting and recognizing the message (receiving the sent packets)
It is metaphorically like the Cell Phone Advertisement --- "Can you hear me now?"

The standard maximum amount (TCP Window Size) regulates the amount of information, such that the sender doesn't get ahead of the receiver, and such that, if the previous packet was not recognized (got corrupted), it can be sent again before continuing on with the message.

If you "open up" your TCP Window Size to 256960, you may "think" that you will be receiving larger chunks of information, and/or will receive more smaller chunks before pausing to return a "received message".... But it doesn't work that way unless the "entire Network" is set up" with larger TCP Window Size (and a few other rather technical tweaks to achieve this faster rate of transmission)
Instead, the "sender" will be "waiting" for your "received message". And when it is not received, will assume that you didn't get the message, and therefore will send the "same packet" over and over again until it is acknowledged.

In the case above, each "packet of up to 64240 would be sent (4) four times because your window is (4) four times the standard size 64KB X 4 = 256KB, before your machine sends back a confirming "received message".... "I heard your message, wrote it down, and am preparing to act on it. Please continue with the rest of the message"

The operational experience could be described as "stuttering", "lag", "choppy" or "jerky".

WarCraft 3 exchanges massive amounts of information between the server and the players. The game server depends on receiving "received" messages from the many online players. If you aren't sending back a "received" message, the server will wait until you do. Granted, the time involved is "milli-seconds" but the accumulated effect is "choppy" and "jerky".

Why have a "Standard Limit"? I explained this somewhat above. But in addition, every machine is going to have a "bottle-neck" which limits the maximum amount (size) of information processed at any instant. Machines have gotten bigger and faster (bigger Network Interface, better Graphics Adapters, more RAM, faster CPU's, larger system Bus chips, etc.) but still there is a "weakest link" in any machine.
Limiting the TCP Receive Window Size is a method that has been accepted to prevent machines from becoming overwhelmed from networked feeds. It's a fact of life for computers that we all live with unless we are on highly specialized networks.
Therefore you should find the best response from your internet connection at the maximum standard of 64240.
(Your mileage may vary. )
______________

Question:

Did you at one time or occasionally play WarCraft 3 on a local network (LAN) in which one of the Players set up a server, and you all set your machines to coordinate with accelerated (larger TCP Window Size) communication? Such a scenario could technically be accomplished, but in most instances would not achieve much of a noticeable improvement in performance.

If you ever did do the above scenario, it would be important to return settings to "Standard" TCP Windows Size that would be compatible with interaction over the Internet with other servers and players that were conforming to "Standard".
____________________________________

Here's the "safe" instructions for maximizing your system's internet connection performance....

To change your TCP Receive Window size:
1. Launch window registry editor by clicking on Start | Run .
2. Click in the Open dropdown box and type in regedit.exe then click OK .
3. Back up your registry by selecting File | Export type in a meaningful file name, in the export range section select All and save to your hard drive. To restore your old registry you simply import this file.
4. Next you need to create a new registry key. On the left side you need to go to the directory HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\Tcpip\Parameters
5. Select Edit | New | DWORD Value .
6. Rename the new registry key to TcpWindowSize.
7. Modify the registry setting for TcpWindowSize by double clicking on the key.
8. Change the Base Setting to Decimal.
9. Enter the value 64240 and click OK, then exit RegEdit.
10. For these settings to take effect you need to close all your open applications and reboot your system.

Comment/Question: Will the above recommendation "fix" your problem?

Well, maybe or maybe not.
But it is SAFE and recommended, whether or not there are other problems and fixes that we eventually discover on your machine.

Please consider performing the above:

• Tune-Up Tips
• Adjust TCP Receive Window Size

[TonyG123]

hey, i am currently on a different computer that is networked up and this computer runs smooth as a nut.. no choppyness or anythin.. if if i ran the PCPitstop full test on this computer and posted it... would you possible be able to compare the 2 and find out whats wrong? and no i havent played any LAN games, at 1 point i could play warcraft 3 on the other computer fine.. but now it just seems like it cant handle big maps, i will do what u said about the TCP thing... and if there is no improvement there i will try defragging.. thanks for your help

[Doug]

Good. Following the PCPitstop Tune-Up Tips is "recommended". Hopefully other Members here will look in on your thread and spot something that I've overlooked. Keep us posted with your progress. As to the "other machine" and a separate PCPitstop Full Test........... sure. go ahead. But please open a separate New Topic for that other machine. I don't want the additional information and comments to interfere with what others may contribute or read in this Thread. :_ Best Regards

[DaChew]

Those hard drive problems look pretty bad, I think I might run the cleanup and defrag even more strenuously 14% file fragmentation is not good I lost some data on a partition I let get too full and fragmented

[Doug]

Hi TonyG123,

I "may" be wrong in my earlier explanation of TCP Windows Size being the culprit.
The information I wrote, does appear to be accurate, but I've since encountered folks whose practical experience is that a larger TCP Receive Window has improved there connection speed on ADSL.

I'd do the change and then test to see if it makes a difference.
You can always set it back to larger.
__________________

Of possibly greater interest to your Choppy and Jerky is the observation that you seem to have both
SIS Graphic Drivers
and
nVidia Graphic Drivers.

This leads me to be curious....
Does your motherboard have "onboard graphics"? ..... possibly using the SIS Driver?

If so, you should "Disable" onboard Graphics via BIOS setting.
You would probably also benefit from Removing the SIS Driver via Device Manager - Display Adapter - Uninstall ( the SIS Driver, but leave the nVidia Driver)
__________________________________

Please inform me... Are you running just a single Monitor? Or have you perhaps been attempting to run two monitors, one from onboard graphics adapter, and one from your nVidia Adapter?

If so, that configuration could cause a bunch of problems and you should be running only one Monitor, from the nVidia PCI-e card.
__________________________________

How about DirectX 9.0c....?
Presumably you have it installed?

However, it might help to reinstall DirectX 9.0c onto your machine again.
You cannot "uninstall DirectX 9.0c" to perform a fresh install, as it becomes too closely integrated into your operating system.
But you can do a fresh installation of it, which may replace any missing or corrupted files in DirectX 9.0c
Get DirectX 9.0c - Here
_______________

Now let's consider your PCI-e Card.
Download the recommended driver for your operating system, here
Using Device Manager, Uninstall your nVidia Graphic Adapter, then reinstall from the Driver you just downloaded.
_________________

Hopefully you have been working on Deleting your Temp Files and Defragging. How's that going?
Please run and post a fresh PCPitstop TechExpress so we can see the fragmentation status.
__________________

With this problem presentation, you actually will benefit from Running CHKDSK /r
Please do so.
If you run CHKDSK /r and it detects errors and fixes them, then you must run it a second time or even a third or more times.
Let us know how many passes it takes before no errors are detected.
Always run CHKDSK /r (1) one extra time, after the last time that no errors were detected.
____________________

Please give some attention to the extra unnecessary applications and processes that you have running from StartUP.
You can see these in the "Window Results" page of your Pit Test Results. They are the ones with blue/purple background and you should disable as many of them as possible via MSCONFIG.

________________________

Change your IE max cache size to 90mb .......... it is presently - 7452 MB
________________

We can review your progress after you get the above accomplished.
I realize I've recommended that you do several relatively time consuming processes.
Consider that each one, will improve the overall functioning of your machine and contribute to better performance.

Best Regards

[TonyG123]

hey ok i defragged my computer over night

If so, you should "Disable" onboard Graphics via BIOS setting.
You would probably also benefit from Removing the SIS Driver via Device Manager - Display Adapter - Uninstall ( the SIS Driver, but leave the nVidia Driver)

ok you can call me dumb, but where do i find the BIOS setting? lol im not very clever when it comes to computers, and yes i think i did originally have an onboard graphics

Please inform me... Are you running just a single Monitor? Or have you perhaps been attempting to run two monitors, one from onboard graphics adapter, and one from your nVidia Adapter?

no i have only ever ran a single monitor

How about DirectX 9.0c....?
Presumably you have it installed?

yep, my brother installed directx 9.0x for me when i wanted to play the C&C Tiberian wars, it wouldnt let me play the game otherwise.

Now let's consider your PCI-e Card.
Download the recommended driver for your operating system, here
Using Device Manager, Uninstall your nVidia Graphic Adapter, then reinstall from the Driver you just downloaded.

i searched for the Device Managers and didnt see any Uninstall your nVidia Graphic Adapter :|

With this problem presentation, you actually will benefit from Running CHKDSK /r

ok i did this and it said: Chkdsk cannot run because the volume is in use by another process. Would you like to schedule the volume to be checked the next time the system is restarted? (Y/N).
i pressed Y and enter and it just went off and didnt do anything? do i need to restart my computer for it to take action?

and as for the IE max cache size, i did that.

thanks for the help, really appreciated.


By the way, here is the PCPitstop results after defragment:
http://www.pcpitstop...RDTTW9B3DGSFZ9G

Edited by TonyG123, 24 March 2008 - 07:58 AM.

[Doug]

TonyG123,

I'm at work and won't be able to give you much attention until later this evening.

Let's find your Display Adapter Driver conflict (if any)

• Open your Device Manager.
• Click on Display Adapter
• Click on the + sign in front of Display Adapter to expand it.
• Write down (with pencil and paper) the "exact-complete" names of the items under Display Adapter
• Post that information into your next reply

BIOS is Basic Input Output System, and is the fundamental set of instructions your machine uses to identify hardware, and to create the environment in which the operating system and application can perform.

Gain access to your BIOS.... if different on various machines.
Often - F1, F2, Del, - Press any one of these keys when you first boot your machine.
Your Boot Screen sequence may tell you what it is.... For SETUP, press (F1, F2, Del, etc) prior to Windows loading.
Watch carefully and read fast because it goes by quickly at Boot.
Once the machine is loading into Windows, you will have to allow the boot cycle and then try again by rebooting.
You can explore around in BIOS/SETUP all you like and may learn some interesting things about your machine.
(Note: Do not make any changes in BIOS/SETUP unless you know what you are doing)
___________________-

Yes, to run CHKDSK, you will have to reply "Y" for yes, and then Reboot.
Your machine will then run CHKDSK when it begins Booting.
Allow it to run its course without any keystrokes or interference.
the scan will examine (5) Five types of locations and can take from 30 minutes to more than an hours depending upon your HD.
___________________

Reinstall DirectX 9.0c anyway.
___________________

Boot into SAFE Mode (start tapping F8 continuously after turning machine on)
A Boot Sequence Menu will appear
Select SAFE Mode
Run your Defrag while in SAFE Mode (it didn't do much good yet, so run it a couple of times in SAFE Mode)
________________________

Disable as many of those unnecessary StartUps as possible.

Start - Run - (type)MSCONFIG - Enter
Select the "StartUps"(Tab)
It is safe to disable most all of those items -- except your AntiVirus and Firewall
Disable any item by removing the checkmark/tick from in front of the item.
Click Apply, Click Close, Allow your machine to reboot.
When Windows opens again it will display an alert that Changes were made in your System Configuration Utility.
We know that..... That's what we just did.
put a checkmark/tick into the small box that says "Don't display this warning again", Then click OK.

Run and post a fresh PCPitstop Full Tests TechExpress.

I'll catch up with you this evening.
Hopefully some other Tech will be able to pick up on your thread today.
Maybe you'll have your machine fixed by the time I read your next PCPitstop TechExpress.

Best Regards

[DaChew]

Those disk results look a lot better, we could do a little with temp junk files and old restore points but wait on that. I don't like the download speed dropping so low, I am on about as lame a broadband setup as you can use, same with your ping.

Last Result:
Download Speed: 3267 kbps (408.4 KB/sec transfer rate)
Upload Speed: 375 kbps (46.9 KB/sec transfer rate)
Latency: 47 ms

http://www.pcpitstop...internet/bw.asp

what's the make and model of that computer?

Edited by DaChew, 24 March 2008 - 09:58 AM.

[DaChew]

this pcpitstops has been educational to say the least

your system is Sis based and agp? the sis drivers for agp indicate that

I doubt there was an onboard nvidia video chipset involved, wonder if there was ever a nvidia agp card installed in the computer?

I have seen issues with older computers running the catalyst control center and net 2, I usually reccomend uninstalling it(CCC/CLI) and letting windows native display control the cards, net 2 is fine.

The onboard sis display utilities running is asking for trouble, the onboard sis is probably auto disabled in bios when you insert an agp card since both devices cannot coexist on the agp northbrige bus at the same time

Have you recently run a total restore or repair to factory settings?

Edited by DaChew, 24 March 2008 - 10:26 AM.

[Doug]

Hi DaChew,

Take a look at the PCPitstop Results.
In the yellow/brownish summary list in the upper-right -- Click on "Installed Hardware"
You will see the nVidia X800GT

You will also notice that the machine operates with a SIS Chipset.
Thus various components will have SIS Drivers.

We should still "uninstall" any SIS related "Graphics Drivers"

[DaChew]

DISPLAY ATI Technologies Inc. RADEON X800GT
DISPLAY ATI Technologies Inc. RADEON X800GT Secondary

beware of having your own page open and his at the same time, the activex and cookies go slightly crazy

Just to be safe I would run an uninstall on the catalyst control center, run a general video driver cleaner and then reinstall only the vid drivers for the ati

the utilities need to go and stay gone

fixing video driver issues is usually a hit or miss black magic operation

Edited by DaChew, 24 March 2008 - 12:25 PM.

[TonyG123]

hey guys i dont have the time to do anything right now im only on my dinner hour, but i should be on later or maybe tomorrow and do some of the things that you said.. once again.. thanks

and by the way..

your system is Sis based and agp? the sis drivers for agp indicate that

what do you mean by this ? im dumb lol

Edited by TonyG123, 25 March 2008 - 06:58 AM.