154 replies to this topic

[Denise_M1]

Hi,

My computer's been on for over 36 hours so I thought it would be a good time to use PC Pitstop after all of the things that I've done with it during the 36 hours. The test results are here:

http://www.pcpitstop...?conid=21222985

[Doug]

Turn your System Restore back "on". What do you plan to do to get that C:\ defragmented? Please do post the StartUp Report (as html) from CodeStuff Starters.

[Denise_M1]

I would have you run a experiment, I would have you do a transfer of files like you would normally do that causes you problem with slowdowns but with a difference.
I would have you unplug from the internet (pull the plug) and turn off (this is very important) all of the antivirus/malware programs you have running.
See if you get the freezing you experienced. Try a movie like you do that gives you the choppy performance and see if it does this.

When I tried this, my computer had been on for over 36 hours. I unplugged my pc from the internet and turned off Avast and Windows Firewall.

When I transferred files from one drive to another, my computer didn't freeze. I purposely chose my worst drives to do this. I had several files moving from each drives to other drives. The files also transferred quickly.

Some of the movies that I played were choppy but others weren't. The reason might be due to their dimensions. They have various dimensions, some as high as 720x576 and others are low as 512x384.

[Denise_M1]

Open Control Panel
Scroll down to and double-click on Regional and Language options
Select - Language(tab)
Press - Details(button)
Select - Advanced(tab) in the new panel that comes up (Text Services and Input Languages)
Add - Checkmark/tick in front of "Turn off advanced text services"
Click - Apply
The click OK, OK to back your way out of Regional and Language Options controls

Doing this made a marked improvement in my computer's performance. There were times when my computer would freeze for a short while when I was doing a lot of things and using one of my drives that have poor performance. Thanks for recommending it


Now I'm going to reboot and perform another PC Pitstop test to see if rebooting increases performance.

[Denise_M1]

Hi Doug,

Turn your System Restore back "on".

I have it turned on. I don't have it turned on for my ext hdds because I have backups of everything that's on them on other ext hdds. I have a backup of C on another ext hdd for things like My Documents, My Pictures, etc.


My C drive is pretty defragmented. I'm going to attach screenshots of the results of a defragmentation that I did last night, a defragmentation in progress in Safe Mode, and a completed defragmentation in Safe Mode, including a report.

Attached Thumbnails

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Attached Files

•  VolumeC_Defrag_report.txt   3.38KB   283 downloads

[Denise_M1]

This is the results of a PC Pitstop test that I just ran, after a reboot.

http://www.pcpitstop...?conid=21222985

[Denise_M1]

I just finished the CodeStuff Starter test.

Attached Thumbnails

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Attached Files

•  CodeStuff_Starter___HTML.html   72.6KB   24 downloads

[Denise_M1]

Processes Tab

Attached Thumbnails

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[Doug]

OK, unnecessary applications are disabled. C:\ is pretty well defragged. C:\ read-write speed Disk Speed Test (Drive C:) 64 MB/s <-- pretty reasonable speed How's the overall performance?

[Denise_M1]

Hi Doug,

This made a noticeable improvement

Add - Checkmark/tick in front of "Turn off advanced text services"

My computer doesn't freeze as often and, when it does, it usually recovers so that I don't have to Reset it.

Another improvement that I've noticed is that there haven't been any overlays. If it would have normally overlayed, it opens slower instead, so that overlay doesn't occur.

One last improvement that I noticed is that, even though I was on the internet for 36 hours, I didn't need to reboot, as was usual. There was some freezing but it recovered itself.

I believe that the test results show that my internet is slow. I've never noticed that it was slow, except for opening my email account. The phishing filter there takes its time. Other pages open quickly, within a few seconds of choosing them.

Some of the ext hdds still have a problem when two files are moved to it, i.e, if one of them has only 15 seconds left to finish moving a file to it, I'll start another. The first one will then slowly but surely raise the amount of time to complete the transfer to past 25 minutes. The second one, which started out at 2 minutes, will also slowly but surely raise the time to complete the transfer to past 25 minutes. If I stop the second transfer and let the first one finish, it will finish within seconds and I can then start the second transfer. The transfer rates are still slow, taking at least 2 minutes to transfer a 750Mb movie from one drive to another, whether it's a SATA, firewire or USB 2.0 drive.

I previously asked this question but didn't get a reply. Would overclocking a bit help?
.

[Denise_M1]

Would overclocking a bit help?

Is this something that I should bring up in another forum?

[Doug]

Denise, No it is just fine here. I'm sorry I have taken so long responding. I have been heavily obligated here locally. I have a reply half-written and will be able to complete it between phone calls and such this evening. Doug

[Doug]

Hi Denise_M1,

First let me say that you have a relatively strong machine in general.
But you have expressed concern that the PCPitstop has reflected that your machine is not performing well.
I disagree.
You should know that millions of people use the PCPitstop Full Tests to review the functioning of their machines.
"Some" of them have actually turned it into a "competitive sport".
They max-out their machines and strip down all the features that would hold their "score" down.
Generally, in addition to some relatively expensive physical upgrades, they have just installed a fresh and stripped down Windows operating system with nothing else onboard, turned off visual effects, have not installed any application software (sometimes not even antivirus), they have no peripheral devices (printer, ext. HD's or anything connected via USB) and their sole intent is to get the highest rating on the PCPitstop Full Tests as possible. In short, they demonstrate that they have a hot basic machine... but the machine as they have it set up is not capable of doing anything except access the internet and run the Pit Tests. These competitive testers may artificially raise the upper maximum limits of global rating, but do not interfere with machine specific results and comparison of similarly configured machines and your same machine between successive testing.

Your machine "scores" in the Top 31%, even with all the applications software and peripheral drives that you have installed, and the loads of data carried by those hard drives.
You're doing just fine with that machine.

Using the PCPitstop Full Tests "realistically" like you have done, can give you valuable information about your machine and its performance, that you can actually "apply" to your real-world usage. Good for you.
_________________________

Much of the performance concerns that you have described have to do with moving large chunks of information from one hard drive to another, and from one hard drive to your display monitor for viewing.

The potential "bottle-necks" of a machine, when used for these purposes include Video Card memory, motherboard chipsets, USB Hubs, RAM, CPU, and "very importantly" the Hard Drives themselves.

Your CPU, RAM, Video Card, and motherboard seem to be functioning well and as expected.,

When moving large chunks of data, it is important to have large amounts of FREE Space at least sufficient to handle the full chunk of data.
For instance, it is impossible for your Windows Defragger utility to put all of a large file into a single continuous location on the hard drive (make the file non-fragmented) unless there is enough free space to write the file all in one continuous location. Your Disk Defragger Reports will tell you which files were not able to be defragged.

Your External HD's have been seriously full, and therefore seriously fragmented.

If you plan to keep those HD's as full as they have been, you will continue to experience file fragmentation and related performance decreases.

You have mentioned that you frequently move various of your media from HD to HD. This practice can possibly contribute to more fragmentation when the HD being "transferred to" does not have sufficient large chunks of free space to write the file into one location.
When writing to Disk, the file system looks for a location large enough to record the entire file in one piece. If none is found, the file will be written beginning at the first free space location until that space is full, and then skipping to the next unused space, and the next and next, until the entire file is written. This process can break a large file into a very large number of small chunks. Seeking the next chunk can lengthen the seek-read-write cycle that is performed when accessing a file for either moving to another HD or simply for displaying for viewing. Clearly, the above described situation can "slow down" your machines performance.

You've also mentioned that you intend to purchase additional HD's.
How you use any additional HD's can make a difference to your system's overall performance.
Obviously if you simply "add" one or more HD's to sort existing files or add new ones, the new HD's will eventually get full.

But if you incorporate the strategy I mentioned back in post #29 you may be able to decrease fragmentation on your storage disks dramatically.
http://forums.whatth...=...st&p=498046

For instance, keep one HD completely empty.
Periodically copy/paste "all" files from a HD that is in use, to the Empty one.
Now all the files are on the previously empty HD and fully "defragmented".
Use copy/paste to move them back and they will be back in their home HD and fully defragmented.

Repeat the above process for all of your storage HD's.

Or to reduce the copy/paste process, you can "leap frog" your "empty HD.
Copy/paste from a full HD to the empty one. Then "delete" files from the previously full HD so that you can now use it as your "empty HD".
Repeat as suggested above.

I would very much like to hear back from you on this strategy and how well it performs for you.
Others may be able to learn from your work.

________________________

As to your questions:

Overclocking?

Maybe a little bit, but probably not noticeable for your uses, and at least not until you get your Hard Drives Defragmented.
Also Remember that Overclocking "will" increase temperatures that will require an improved cooling solution.
And, because of increased work, voltage, and heat, it is "likely" that Overclocking will reduce the lifetime of your machine.
________________________

I'm glad that you've found disabling cftmon.exe to cause an improvement.
Another "default setting" of Windows is to have "Indexing" enabled on all storage disks.
"indexing", when activated, reads and keeps additional logs of where it finds various reference to supposedly increase the speed of a File Search.
So for instance, if you want to find all documents with the term "remarkable sunsets" in the text, Indexing will have made a record that will help the Search function find those instance.

However, with "indexing" running in the background constantly whenever HD's are read/writing, the overall processing speed is reduced.
Switching off Indexing may make any one Search a tiny bit slower, but will speed up general computer use.

Right-click on the drive letter for each drive.
For instance, Drive L:\
Then Select - Properties
On the General(tab) you will notice a sentence at the very bottom: "Allow Indexing Service to index this disk for fast file searching"
Remove the Checkmark/tick to turn off Indexing.

It will require a period of time from several seconds to a few minutes for the disk to run through all of the files and turn off Indexing for all of them.
Occasionally you will receive a report that Indexing cannot be shut off for a specific file.... for some specified reason.
that's OK. Just Select - Ignore and allow the rest of the files to be removed from Indexing.

Keep us posted with your progress.

Best Regards

[Digerati]

[on soapbox]
You should never overclock an unstable system. To expand on Doug's comments a bit - Ohm's Law is the Law of Physics that defines the basic relationship between resistance, current, and voltage in any given circuit, and how each of those affect power. It states that increasing voltage in a circuit causes the current to increase. When current goes up power consumption goes up, and so does heat - the bane of all electronics. The problem is compounded because when heat goes up, resistance goes down, which increases current, which increases power, which increases heat and so on and so on. When that cycle gets out of control, it is called "thermal runaway" and results in tripped safety devices, if lucky, smoke, fire and destruction, and in extremes cases, loss of life, if not. Students of electronics are well aware of that, and regulation and protective circuits are included in the design. However, the engineer's design rarely survives those who control the purse strings and the quality and capability is often less determined by the design specs, but rather budget, assembly and manufacturing quality, component quality and tolerances, and the scruples of the factory manager. Obviously, low quality and low budget devices are less immune to abuse - and overclocking is abuse, make no mistake. Overclocking places a greater demand on everything on that bus, the motherboard's regulator circuits, power supply, case cooling, CPU and CPU cooling, chipset and chipset cooling, and more. Even if all goes well, some components are running warmer than normal which, as Doug noted, affects device aging. It is not just running warmer or hot for long periods, but the temperature swing from cold to hot is wider, resulting in more extreme contraction/expansion cycles as the "matter" cools and heats. This causes "fatigue" or microfractures in the materials, adversely affecting aging too.

From a technician's standpoint, one who has to clean up the mess afterwards, I am always amazed when a fried overclocked machine comes in and the user is in a panic because his entire life is on that machine.

I find it interesting, disturbing, and a deceptive marketing ploy by motherboard makers who are building in overclocking capabilities, and bundling overclocking utilities with their new motherboards. From an engineering standpoint, you don't build in "overclocking capabilities" - you design to meet the requirements, with standard textbook overheads necessary for "expected" variables (operating environments, supply voltages, component tolerances, etc.). It is the "marketers" and "advertising companies" that are trying to reach that "risk-taking" enthusiast in all of us by "dummying down" published specifications so folks can feel good about bumping it up a bit.

The facts are damages that can be attributed to overclocking or excessive heat from overclocking are not covered under warranty by the motherboard makers, RAM makers, Intel or AMD. If you overclock and fry the CPU, your loss. If the CPU overheats and takes out the socket destroying the motherboard, your loss. If PSU goes too, and takes out everything with it, your loss.

I am not totally against overclocking, it can be a fun challenge, especially when experimenting with alternative cooling too. I just think it should be understood that it is a hobby that requires a lot of homework and a greater commitment to hardware health monitoring and preventative maintenance. Losses should be expected. If the computer is needed for work, school or personal business, it should not overclocked, or at least ensure a robust backup plan is in place, and current. And again, never overclock an unstable computer.

If you want more power, I recommend buying it - or put it on your list to Santa.

For another twist - With some PCs used in home theater systems where fan noise is bad, underclocking is used to keep systems cool, and therefore quiet. But it works.
[off soapbox]

Edited by Digerati, 12 November 2008 - 09:07 AM.
spell check

[Blair]

I find it interesting, disturbing, and a deceptive marketing ploy by motherboard makers who are building in overclocking capabilities, and bundling overclocking utilities with their new motherboards. From an engineering standpoint, you don't build in "overclocking capabilities" - you design to meet the requirements, with standard textbook overheads necessary for "expected" variables (operating environments, supply voltages, component tolerances, etc.). It is the "marketers" and "advertising companies" that are trying to reach that "risk-taking" enthusiast in all of us by "dummying down" published specifications so folks can feel good about bumping it up a bit.

Hi, my name is Blair, and I'm an overclocker.

Overclocking success depends greatly on the components you're trying to overclock. Only some will lead to success, and justify the expense. I have a different view on whether companies engineer overclocking capabilities into their products. What's the difference between a 2.4 GHz (or even 2.33) and 3.0 GHz Intel Core 2 Quad CPU? The silicon is identical (same cores). One runs a front side bus of 1033 MHz, the other 1300 MHz. The 2.4 GHz has simply been crippled by marketing to offer a new price point. I happen to own the 2.4 GHz, and it's running just fine in my system at 3.0 GHz. I simply raised the front side bus speed to 1300 MHz. My RAM, and motherboard are designed for 1300 MHz, and the CPU is running at the default voltage, with the stock cooler. I can run Prime95 all day, it's as stable as any 3.0 GHz CPU. My system doesn't run hot, and is nearly silent. I have a system that's over 25% faster, at a savings of several hundred dollars. Now, will you have success overclocking a 3.0GHz to 3.6? Not likely. It hasn't been designed to run at those speeds. But the 2.4 certainly has.

Maybe at one time CPUs were speed binned, but speed differences today are mostly a result of the marketing department, not the engineering department. With the right components, overclocking can be perfectly safe, and sane.