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So Much For Swi


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#16 cnm

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 11:03 PM

We are hoping that Mike will reconsider when he cools off. There can be no SpywareInfo Forums without him.
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#17 kazzoo

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Posted 01 November 2003 - 11:54 PM

Heck of away to do your first post at a Forum. :(

I start this with the statement that:

This is my own opinion/Rant/belief and does not reflect or represent SWI or TOMCoyote organizations policies/opinions whatsoever.


I have to say there is a freedom and a joy when you can help and not be tied to a "corporate" motivation in the back of your mind.

You are free to recommend and suggest anything and everything that will work to solve a problem and not worry if the "Boss" will get upset if you didnt recommend his/her product. There might be a paying customer out there you could have turned.

Thus the LavaSoft pretzel. You have to get your "plug" in anytime you can. If it is not policy it surely must be expected or suggested in the culture.

I would bet you if you suggested something else once too often you would be history. Mind you it is a good product, but its like a screwdriver, it doesnt work well as a wrench when you need a wrench.

One of things that made/makes SWI work, was the helpers were independant of the products SWI promoted. They had no stake in it. They would be one of the first to tell you if it worked or not.

It attracted individuals who were/are independant and strong of opinion and experience. Welcomed most anywhere free of any agenda other than the elimination of Scum/spy/hijack software.

Personally I think we got into this state of affairs because LS let so many folks hanging waiting for the current version to come out. Plus when it did come out, there was some snags in its operation.

What software doesnt? People naturally sought other choices because they needed something RIGHT NOW and came use other products. They also sought out help in other places and forums.

The other choices got press, popularity and endorsements LS didnt recieve. LS relized it has/had a big job to recover the lost customers and trust. They (LavaExperts) set about comming to other forums and sitting in commenting inappropriately at times promoting their software and how easy/great/better it was.

I say again it is a good tool, but not the only tool.

LS is not everything and everything is not LS. :blink:

It was irritating and caused helpers tempers to rise. Requests for correction or retraction was met with attitudes and bannings from the LS forum. Many of the helpers at SWI are/were long time posters at the LS forums and couldnt understand why the mention of anything but LS would result in this action.

Goes back to that corporate motivation again. LS cant be seen that way.

For those who are worried about the fine help and knowledge SWI provides/provided:

The same helpers/developers/experts that are/were around SWI can be found here as well as the other forums as they always have been.

Nothing has changed other than the forums being down at SWI till some of this gets worked out.

Again remember I am speaking for myself, and do not have any connection or interest in SWI or TomCoyote other than being a poster like anyone else. So if you want to beat someone up about this post, its me you should be after.

good luck :wavey:
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#18 siljaline

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 12:34 AM

I am at a loss for words for the moment! :thumbdown:
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#19 kazzoo

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 12:43 AM

Odd thing, just went to the SWI site and found that the owner there has written a statement quite simuliar to my previous post. Believe me (or not) I didnt write mine AFTER reading his. Something about great minds think alike......... B)
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#20 Blacksheep

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 12:45 AM

Well said kazzoo. We must not lose focus on the war against scumware/spyware/hijackware... Internet freedom, privacy and security are at stake.
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#21 music_beans_returns

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 01:22 AM

Shall we spike Mike?

#22 Coyote

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 01:38 AM

Let us all not forget the road of which Mike, I and a heck of a lot of people I know have come down to get to where we are in this fight against spyware, adware, hijacks, etc etc etc..... This does and can take a toll on a person, I have been through burnouts and long sleepless nights, many arguments, many more disagreements..... These kinds of situations do eventually resolve given time and an open mind.... Give Mike some time now to find out what he wants to do next, no judgements on the current page till he has time to reflect on it himself..... Thank you for listening/reading this post Tom Coyote Wilson
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#23 music_beans_returns

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 01:41 AM

Too late, I just did. Did it at the Soap Box. He won't expect me to come back. :unsure:

#24 mitchshrader

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 01:59 AM

I've posted enough about this issue. Errors get made, people make mistakes. Communication isn't perfect. All normal glitches that are part of real life. The big part of a mistake is defending it. Let's all avoid that bit, hmm? I've made some comments that weren't helpful, no matter how righteous my intent. I've also stuck both feet in my mouth and gone for a hike, several memorable times.. SWI has on balance been the finest single forum for privacy and free speech I know of, this past year. Dozens and dozens of folks contributed. Many still do, (or 'would') if possible. All of 'em depend on ONE person being in the middle to provide a focus. Mike Healan. He's not the 'boss' except by courtesy, and respect freely given. But we still NEED him. Boss' is a title of affection, an honor. Not a job description. I hope he hasn't lost sight of his original intent, tangled up in personal conflicts. We'd have one heck of a time finding anyone else to do his part.

#25 Angoid

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 03:59 AM

I enjoyed those forums too ... most days I'd take a look before work started and again during lunchtime to see whether there was anything I could help with or was interested in. I do hope Mike will re-open them in due course, because sometimes all it takes for the bad to prevail is for the good to do nothing. However much we respect Mike, we must never consider him, or anyone else as indispenible - there is always this forum and the new-integration one, but it's still going to be a big loss nevertheless.
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#26 ChrisRLG

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 04:55 AM

My first post here also, CNM will you continue our training here or at NI for now, I have a vice, its helping people, and I'm currently in cold turkey.
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#27 Guest_Bash_*

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 05:05 AM

The people who were arguing too much , threatening to leave, acting like petty kids and selfish brats should really apologise (to Mike) IMHO.

#28 Terminator

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 06:27 AM

What the HELL has been going on? ? ?

I just saw Mike's notification to CLOSE SWI !!


Boy, has he been mad off by someone. I thought that LS v SWI would calm down in Expert forum and be "grown up" enough to actually get this sorted. I have no idea what was said or done but I don't like it.

I've been with SWI almost from the begining and I regard it as much my baby as Mike does. I've worked my butt off to help others, as Mike has done. Mike supplied us with that forum. He paid for it out his own pocket and donations. He worked the board keeping it accessible to all.

And the only gratitude shown was that members were going to walk out? You couldn't sit in the Expert forum, out of public eye, and discuss the problems openly and rationally?

What an ideal opportunity but you let it slip by because of a childish attitude that rivals the attitude LS has.
I am heart broken that you slid to their depths. SWI is and should still be the best and only forum for quality help. SWI has amassed the best tech support on the net.

It is the quality of the support given that made SWI the best of the bunch. I thank you all for the time and support you gave so freely and it has been a pleasure working with you all but this time I am with Mike. I never thought my friends could be like this.

#29 TonyKlein

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 06:43 AM

Although I certainly have my problems with some of the LS people, Mike is right: it's his board, and it's up to him to decide who gets to post where. I really do understand his point, but I didn't feel that affair warranted such an incredibly drastic step. IMHO we were just in the middle of the discussion when he pulled the plug. Personally, I wouldn't consider actually leaving the board for something like that: after all I KNOW Mike's motives are beyond suspicion! What I would certainly settle for, and I gather what Mo also implied, is that it would be nice to have a separate private section for board matters, where stuff like that could be discussed, and keep the so called Expert Section there is at present reserved for the discussion of new threats. IMHO, if one or two people don't feel like talking about it, and threaten to leave, fine, let them go. However, I firmly believe the shouldn't delete the forums for that, in the process disappointing thousands of people who come there for support.

Edited by TonyKlein, 02 November 2003 - 06:45 AM.


#30 black_swan

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Posted 02 November 2003 - 06:57 AM

Hi everyone... :wavey: Thanks for accepting my membership. :)

Now THAT was a shock. :o You shut your internet connection off and go to bed for a couple of hours, and when you wake up, the SWI forums are gone! Nix! Vanished! :blink:

Anyway let's hope Mike does reconsider it. Nothing will ever be the same again without the SWI forums. :(

BS (rosso_acido at SWI)

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