Mixing 4-4-4-12 with 5-5-5-5-12 Ram

I'm having a little problem finding an answer to this. My ram is 2x 1024mb Corsair Xms2 Twin2X 800 4-4-4-12 bought about 3yrs ago when I built my present PC. My wife is about to buy some ram for her new PC build (finally moving up from her beloved and tricked up Pentium 3 and 98SE). I'd like one 1GB of ram more, not 2GB as I run XP and W7 on the same HD, so I'm encouraging her to get 4x1 sticks of course, as finding one stick only for myself is pie in the sky. Seems I can't find any XMS2 Corsair with 4-4-4-12 latency. It's all 5-5-5-12 now for some reason. IF I add a 1GB stick.of 5-5-5-12, will the other 2 sticks automatically reduce to the slower latency or do I need to adjust them in the Bios, or doesn't it matter? What about changing the single 5-5-5-12 to 4-4-4-12 {only)?. Would it be stable and indeed,, can I change individual ram stick latency in the Bios, or do any changes affect all sticks? At a guess, voltage draw on both types of XMS2 are probably the same.. Cheers, Lee

I'd like one 1GB of ram more, not 2GB as I run XP and W7 on the same HD

I don't understand that statement. What does XP and W7 on the same HD have to do with your RAM configuration? I've never heard or seen anything to suggest that matters.

As for your question, as long as your motherboard supports the RAM, it should work. But since you didn't list the motherboard, we have no way of telling. In any case, I would let the motherboard sort out the timings and leave the BIOS alone. Have you checked the motherboard maker's RAM compatibilty list for that motherboard? Or the common RAM wizards for compatible RAM?

Crucial - Memory Advisor
Corsair - Memory Configurator (manual data entry only)
GeIL - Memory Configurator (manual data entry only)
Kingston - Memory Search (manual data entry only)
Mushkin - Advisor
OCZ - Memory Configurator (manual data entry only)
Patriot - Memory Search (manual data entry only)
PNY - Memory Configurator (manual data entry only)
SuperTalent - Memory Finder (manual data entry only)

The following retailers have auto-scanners and manual wizards. They sell brand name and/or "house" brand (re-branded) RAM.

Newegg - Memory Configurator System Tool
MemoryStock - Upgrade Configurator
18004Memory? – Configurator
4AllMemory - Memory advisor (automatic and manual)
TigerDirect - Memory Configurator (manual data entry only)

I will note that dual channel archetecture has been around for longer than 3 years. So if your motherboard supports dual channel, you should buy and install sticks in pairs to take advantage of dual channel's benefits. That said, mixing RAM types in the same pair can cause problems. At best, it simply disables dual-channel and runs the pair in single channel mode. At worst, the computer does not boot.

I'd like one 1GB of ram more, not 2GB as I run XP and W7 on the same HD

As for your question, as long as your motherboard supports the RAM, it should work. But since you didn't list the motherboard, we have no way of telling.

We were discussing my system only a few days ago. ("Video Card suitability"): http://forums.whatthetech.com/index.php?showtopic=113269

"The board is MSI K9N Platinum that is a good board, ready to upgrade to 64bit when I am.
Proccessor: AMD Athlon 64X2 4600 (2.4MHz)
Ram: Cosair TwinX 800 2x1G DDR2"

And yes, thanks for your advice there Digerati, the new 9800GT Video Card went in yesterday and works fine with my PC setup, both with XP and W7. I havn't tried the card with a game yet though.

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Back to this present.

I was pretty sure it was 3GB max. ram for windows XP, except for XP64? So I mentioned XP being on the same HD as W7 (which does handle 4GB of ram or more). I wasn't sure if 4GB of ram would create issues for the XP as naturaly both OS's would be useing the same ram when either OS is in use. So my mentioning XP and W7 being on the same Drive, is relevant information isn't it?

Good point about the duel channel. After 3yrs. (when I installed it), I'd forgotten my board supports duel channel. I'd loose that currently working feature slotting in an extra single stick of ram.

I guess I'll wait until I upgrade both my XP and W7 to 64bit and then stick in some 2GBX2 ram then and be done with it.

OK, no problem then.

Thanks for the help Digerati.

So I am assuming your XP is 32-bit. If you have more than 4Gb (not 3) with a 32-bit OS, the rest should just be ignored.

So my mentioning XP and W7 being on the same Drive, is relevant information isn't it?

Different partitions though, right? So those would be seen as different drives.

I have a Dell Precision 370 X64 system with 4GB of ram. I ran XP on it for a while and it saw 3.23 GB of ram. I now run Windows 7 X64 and it sees 4GB of ram of which 3GB is usable, the rest is sucked up by Win 7 for device use or something like that.

Thanks for that info. Ztrucker

Yeah, if you have more memory than your 32-bit operating system will see (I say 32-bit, because Windows 7 32-bit is no more capable of seeing much past 3Gb than Win XP) it will just not use it.

You definitely want to pair the memory. I would not recommend using different timings, all though, its likely the motherboard will run at the slower speed on all modules. With the amount of trouble incompatible RAM can cause it may be a long time before you know for sure it is causing you issues. Ideally, you would want to use the same RAM speeds, and pair them up.

It doesn't need to be the same brand. Just similar timings and voltages.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList….Id=1&name=4

This should all be 4-4-4-12 memory. The problem is, those timings appear to be associated with chips that use higher than the standard 1.8v DDR2 memory voltage. Almost all of them are 1.9v or higher. This is a problem. The memory modules should be run at their required voltages, but any chips that run at more than 1.8v needs to be manually set in the BIOS. The voltage setting in the BIOS effects all chips. You don't want to over voltage your chips because that produces more heat and shortens life. Therefore, like I said, you should get chips that run at the same voltage as the chips your currently have and make sure the BIOS is set to that proper voltage. Visiting corsair's website, I am unable to find exactly what memory you have. It appears that they have "tested" the memory at the 4-4-4-12 speed and 2.1v, but none of it, that I found, actually is rated for 4-4-4-12 timings. Can you be more specific as to the model number of the RAM you have? I want to see what voltage and speed it is supposed to run at.

EDIT: Is it this memory? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx…N82E16820145034 It runs at 2.1v. It sure would be good to just match what you have already.

EDIT: Is it this memory? http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx…N82E16820145034 It runs at 2.1v. It sure would be good to just match what you have already.

I wish Appleoddity, but there is plenty of that stuff here (5-5-5-15).
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It gets very messy (confusing and conflicting) when reading about ram and Windows OS's.

Even from Microsoft website faithfuls: "XP 64bit was not a real 64bit, Vista was and oh what a mess that was when it came out!".

"XP only sees 3.2GB of ram but can't use more than 2GB" and "Windows sees 4GB but only uses 2GB, but there is a 3GB 'switch' in advanced boot options that when activated allows some applications to access an extra GB" etc, etc.

Yawn, Yawn
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Ok, about my ram,

I have the packing in front of me. It reads XMS2 with DHX in a yellow bubble to the right. DHX is a gee wizz advanced cooling feature. Probably needed because of extra voltage requirements for 4-4-4-12.

On the rear of the packaging: TWIN2X2048-6400C4DHX D. Copyright 2007.

I bought this ram about 2yrs ago when I bought W7, which replaced 2x512mb of the same which I stupidly sold. I could have used those sticks now and maintained my MB's duel threading feature with no mixed timings problem. I can no longer find that ram timing here in online stores or on e-bay. Not even in the US.

Some readers might think when reading this, why not forget it, sell the ram and go out and buy all new matching ram for the wife's new PC she's building and for my own PC (looks like I might have too)?
I would in a flash if we had US prices here for anything PC. It's all mostly double and our income doesn't seem to be moving in an upward direction lately but boy, the cost of living sure is

Actually Lee, none of the memory I linked to on newegg is 5-5-5-15. It is all 4-4-4-12. The specific Corsair chips I linked to run at 2.1v just like the chips you currently have.

Like I said previously, you don't have to match the brand, just the timing and voltage.

It looks like your chips run at 2.1v too. Just match another pair of chips with 4-4-4-12 and 2.1v then make sure those are the timings and voltages you are using in the BIOS.

Searching for information on your chips I found this link: http://www.idealo.co.uk/compare/772976/cor…cl4.html#offers

Not sure what part of the world you are in, but that appears to be 5 or 6 places that are selling it in the UK.

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Actually Lee, none of the memory I linked to on newegg is 5-5-5-15. It is all 4-4-4-12.
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Searching for information on your chips I found this link: http://www.idealo.co.uk/compare/772976/cor…cl4.html#offers

Not sure what part of the world you are in, but that appears to be 5 or 6 places that are selling it in the UK.

I live in Australia Apploditty.

From the UK link: you posted
That ram might have the same 4-4-4-12 timing I have, but it's not available here. The price would be about the same if it was: "Corsair XMS2 DHX memory 2 GB 2 x 1 GB DIMM 240pin DDR2
52.29 + 5.23 postage (local, not OS) = 57.52 English Pounds………That is Australian$99.55 – US$88.81

From the New Egg link you originaly posted: No, it's not 4-4-4-12 at all, it's 5-5-5-18 (and I wouldn't try to overclock it to 4-4-4-12) See attached snipings at top.

Also up there are a couple of 'Cons.' coments from buyers on the same New Egg page. I've now read similar comments about it here in OZ. Sounds like el-cheapo 'value' ram masquerading as quality.

Aust. e-bay has lots of it selling new at about $90-100 Aust with postage. Plenty of it selling 'used' too from people who bought it and are now trying to get rid of it !


Can you reccomend a good quality Kingston 1024mb X 2 ram ?

I'll sell the ram I have and buy 2 lots of what you reccomend if I can get it here (probably can). Thanks Apploditty.

Cheers,

Lee

PS EDIT:

I finally found my ram (it's the same ram as the English site has): http://www.corsair.com/products/xms2dhx/default.aspx It's the 4-4-4-12 one, 2nd from the top. At 2.1v it runs at 4-4-4-12.
Can't find it in OZ, but I don't think I trust (recent) Corsair ram anymore anyway.

Lee, I'm not sure what you mean that it is 5-5-5-15. Newegg may have put the wrong information on the listing. If you click the specifications tab, all the memory on the link I provided has 4-4-4-12 timing. Maybe a quick research of the model of RAM just to make sure of the specifications are accurate, but it all is supposedly 4-4-4-12. UNless the information has been entered incorrectly on the website. I've never been a big RAM fanatic. The few machines that I have seen with "high performance" memory have been nothing but problems, and changing the RAM to some standard DDR2 667Mhz made the computer run better than ever. Personally, I'd never consider any of this stuff on my own systems, but that is just me. So, I'm probably not the best one here to be recommending which "performance" memory to use, as my suggestion is to buy some standard 667Mhz, or 800Mhz RAM. This is how I avoid dealing wtih incompatibilities and instabilities. I've also always bought the cheapest memory I could find. Memory is memory in my opinion. You may be able to buy high performance memory and get better performance from a machine, but if it stores a 1 and gives me back a 1, then thats all it needs to do. And, cheap memory is just as good at doing that as expensive memory. And it all has a lifetime warranty, because if it works out of the box, it will probably NEVER fail.

I hear what you are saying Appleoddity. Any ram is good If bits go in as 1 and come out as 1. That might be fine for general computing, but for intense computer tasks such as in today's gaming, where 10 to 15G of of game info is being accessed at high frame rates and screen resolutions, I don't think 'Value select ' 667Mhz ram is going to cut the mustard, do you?. Please tell me I'm wrong, I'd love the $ savings as I hate spending money on hardware I only 'think' I need. Assumptions in all areas of PC's and OS' ect. are very easy to develop as you have obviously witnessed all over the net and here too in various threads. I'm always looking to knock mine on the head and replace them with helpful accurate knowledge whenever I can, as I hate to pass on assumptions to others. I've never had any issues with high performance ram as long as it is good stuff and in a decent quality mainboard. I really do wish I didn't need ANY quality hardware it at all. I'm slowly heading that way though, as my interest in gaming has rapidly declined over the years. It would be great to enjoy the cost savings of 'budget' PSU's, Mainboards and Ram etc. etc. Cheers, Lee

I bought this ram about 2yrs ago when I bought W7

Ummm, W7 just came out last October.

And actually, as I mentioned earlier, as long as your motherboard supports the RAM, mixing RAM speeds is not normally a problem and should work fine. Do some people have problems? Yes. But people have been mixing and matching for years with no problems.Yes, it will toggle down to the slowest speeds. And unless you match up the pairs for dual channel and trips for triple channel, you may not be able to take advantage of dual or triple channel. And while I am not a fan of overclocking in general, do not attempt any overclocking unless your RAM is perfectly matched.

If you can match, fine. If not, get close and it should work. That said, if you are talking "intense gaming" as your last post suggests, I would not waste time and just swallow the pill, toss the existing pair, and buy 4 new, matching RAM from the same maker. I've been using a lot of Mushkin lately - with no problems.

Sometime a guy deserves a break.

Da Dah !

Here it is: http://www.itspot.com.au/corsair-corsair-t…ms2-p43941.html

An Ozzie shop and my present ram exactly

I can maintain my mainboards duel chanel.

I've already bought a pack, but have advised Zoe (my wife) to buy something else more plentiful.

"I'm not buying that slow old-fashioned stuff. Get with the groove old man; haven't you heard of 1000MGz ram?"

My lips remained sealed. I'm not going to go there. She's younger than I am and is in the gaming site(s) 'groove'


PS.
My poor credit card!

I can maintain my mainboards duel chanel.

That's good. It is a significant performance benefit that also has been around for years that is too often overlooked. And with all your RAM matching exactly (in theory and on paper anyway - fingers crossed) you should not have to deal with any timing issues.